Ep. 44 Alisa Fraser, Co-Founder of al.ive– The Honest CEO Show

The Honest CEO Show, Episode 44: Alisa Fraser, Co-Founder of al.ive

Caroline Kennedy (00:20)
Welcome to The Honest CEO Show. I'm your host Caroline Kennedy. Today I'm joined by Alisa Fraser, one half of the twin powerhouse behind al.ive. Many of you first met Alisa and her sister, Lysandra on The Block where their design and their grit and their unshakable bond captivated the nation. But the real story has been unfolding since the cameras stopped rolling.

Together they've built al.ive, a brand that's redefining conscious luxury in home and body care. And they recently expanded into skincare, stepping into one of the most competitive and cutthroat industries in the world. So from reality TV to running multi-million dollar businesses, theirs is a story of reinvention, risk and resilience. So welcome to the show, Alisa.

Alisa Fraser (01:09)
Thank you. What a lovely introduction.

Caroline Kennedy (01:11)
We are really excited to share your story with our listeners. So like we talked about, many of our listeners and viewers first met you on The Block. What did that experience teach you about pressure and partnership?

Alisa Fraser (01:26)
It taught us so much and I think that's probably a big reason why we can handle so much stress now because the pressure was insane and it was a prolonged pressure and it was something that most people would never experience that kind of stress and pressure in their lifetime. So it has definitely carried over to, you know, helping help us in what we do now.

Caroline Kennedy (01:49)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And if you were to be able to describe the pressure, could you?

Alisa Fraser (01:53)
No, I don't think you can explain it to anybody that hasn't been on our block, but not only it was our block specifically because we did two blocks, but the first one, it was the longest block in history to film. So it was 17 weeks. But to put it into perspective, did, we made over an old, it was called the Viz Motel in Melbourne. And it was, so they split the hotel floors into like apartments. So we had, there were, I think there were, eight hotel rooms on one level that we had to demolish and get ready for the next week.

Every single week, you get a week to do your room, but every single week we had to demolish a bedroom and a bathroom. So before you even started the week, the physical work in, and I'm talking like the bedroom is carpet, skirting boards, beds, curtains, cupboards. And then the bathroom was a bath, a vanity, a toilet, taking all the tiles off the wall, not only that in the bedrooms, they had, you know, that old popcorn ceiling. So because we had to plasterboard the ceiling, for legal reasons and regulatory reasons, the ceiling had to be a certain height. So in order for us to be able to direct the plasterboard to the ceiling, we then had to scrape away this popcorn ceiling, put all the fairing channels and there was probably like 100 fairing channels in the ceiling which we had to scrape with a jackhammer like this with dust just coming down and then we had to screen all the fairing channels before we even started the week and that was eight times over so for 17 weeks every single so I think we've got like eight days to do reveal but it was even seven or eight but--

Caroline Kennedy (03:40)
Did you even sleep?

Alisa Fraser (03:52)
Every single night we would get into bed at three o'clock in the morning and then up at 6 a.m. And then two nights before reveal, it was like all night. So we didn't sleep. And that was like that for 17 weeks. We got so strong. We lost so much weight. We weren't, we didn't have time to eat. You would just go, go, go, go, go. So by the end of the day, you'll be like, I haven't had time to eat. We don't have time. You just have to keep going. So I can't put it into words how hard it was but at the same time it was the first series we had been on so the adrenaline like was pumping and it 100 % got us through like we were on a high we were loving every minute as hard as it was.

Caroline Kennedy (04:32)
For context to listeners, how long would it generally take for something like that in the real world?

Alisa Fraser (04:38)
For that whole bill, you could easily 18 months, two years. Yeah.

Caroline Kennedy (04:43)
My god.

Yeah. So that gives you a sense of the pressure. Yeah. And you guys have proved that you were so much more than reality TV contestants. And at times you can be underestimated as a result of that. We see that play out a lot. How did you guys rise above that? Because you've done it so well. I think.

Alisa Fraser (05:04)
We honestly went on there without, and it was kind of almost before, I feel like kind of just after we were on, the whole reality TV kind of landscape changed a little bit. So we went on without any expectations. We wanted to win some money. We were massive Block fans. So there wasn't any like, we're going to get onto the show and we're going to win. And then we're going to just like be influencers and try and make this new life for ourselves. So it was very organic and we almost just fell into it.

So I think because it was organic and because we are extremely driven and hardworking. And you know, I think the big thing was like Shaynna, one of the judges on The Block said like, you girls need to do this for a living. And like having that backing and that confidence, like, it really helped to be able to make that big step. But to be honest, I just think it comes down to hard work, dedication, and we just don't give up. And the thing is, it's a long bloody slog. And it's been 14 years. Do you know what mean? Like so many people go on to log work these days.

I'm going to make a career. I'm going to do this. I'm going to move into design. I'm going to do. But at the end of the day, like since we finished The Block for the first six years, we were still working up until probably one a.m. every night. And I work like we work just as hard now after 14 years. And I think probably the biggest misconception is just because you're on reality TV, it means that you're to have a name and a life after the show. But the reality is, is it takes a lot of hard work and dedication. And 99 percent of people aren't willing to put in that hard work.

So, but as well, they don't also have the drive or the passion or, and it is, it's just, I think potentially like we, we didn't grow up with much money. We grew up in housing trust with a single mum. And I think our upbringing has definitely played a big part of why we are so driven and successful because we wanted to create a better life. I think if people haven't been through that, it's the drive probably not in them as much either.

Caroline Kennedy (07:01)
Yeah, and I think also to the resilience, right? Because I grew up in adversity through childhood and my resilience is pretty strong because you have to, you've got no choice, right? You've got to keep showing up, you've got to keep pushing through because there's no other choice.

Alisa Fraser (07:15)
No one's going to come along and save you. You've got to kind of make your own. Yeah.

Caroline Kennedy (07:18)
Yeah. Yeah. where did the idea then, like, what was the spark for the idea with al.ive come from?

Alisa Fraser (07:27)
It came out of, like many things do, a really kind of shitty situation where we had finished, we'd invested, we bought a house to flip in Melbourne. The holding costs were ridiculous. We didn't understand being in the heritage overlay just how hard it would be to get through council. Holding costs over two years on a million dollar property, a couple million dollar property is huge, right? So it's eating into your profit.

And not only that, we kind of bought in the peak. then there was a stage between COVID where the market turned really bad. And it just happened to be that time. anyway, we were designing, we were styling the bathrooms and the apartment for photos. And we're in Melbourne and we just couldn't find anything in the bathroom and for the bathroom. And it didn't really kind of hit us then. But when it didn't go to plan and we lost a couple of hundred thousand dollars on this renovation, we were like, well, this is what we were gonna do.

We got back to Adelaide and I'm never one for like, if something doesn't work, like give me 10 minutes to go like shit. But then like my brain just automatically goes into like, how do we turn this around into something positive? Cause I'm a true believer that everything happens for a reason. And I was, we were sitting in the office, know, interior design office. I said to Lysandra, just randomly, I just said, well, we should, cause my brain goes a million miles an hour.

We should collaborate with a soap company like a Palmolive and do like a designer range because I couldn't find anything. She was like "Palmolive" ⁓ that's a silly idea. There's so many soaps on the market. And I'm like, there's not. And anyway, was like, best thing she could have really done because like anyone tells me like it's like you can't do anything or it's a dumb idea. It's like gives me more motivation to like do it. So I pretty much went underground for six months and I didn't say anything to her because I from that point, and I cannot explain this to you, is like something jumped into my body and it hasn't left. And I just had this clarity of like what it needed to be. Like, and I just became obsessed. I just went underground and sent a million emails and tried to educate myself on what product development looks like and how you bring a product to market.

And anyway, sitting on the beach one day and writing some logo, like some names and...I sitting there, was like, all right, well, how do we bring the designer and our name into it, A and L, but without making it obvious? And we've been given this amazing opportunity to have a presence out there and how do we make sure that it stands for something? And I love nature, we both love nature. it was, right, how can we, know, what can we do to bring light to, it was either like, it has to be some kind of environmental or charity aspect to it.

Because we love nature so much and we thought, all right, well, I thought, how can we incorporate our name into it? How can we create a product that makes you feel a certain way and how can we help? And I was like, how can we help keep the planet alive? And then I was like, cause I was writing the A and the L and I was like, well, I was like, how do want people to feel when they use the product? You want them to feel alive? And then I was like, al.ive and I was like, that's it.

And I was at the beach and I was like, all right, kids are going, need to go home. I need to design a logo. And within that night, the was designed. I was on the phone with my graphic designer and we had literally created it. And I literally said, this is exactly how I want it. And we didn't make a change to it. The very first option she sent, I'm like, yep, that's it. And then from there, it's just been like, ever since. Go, go. really kind of when you think about it, it's such an unusual course for life to take. But it was so clear. It was like, this is, and I think what it does is it proves that there can be such a trade market. you just need to find your own unique value proposition. And ours was creating a styling item that was also functional that went in any kind of decor also as beautiful on the inside as it is on the out. we don't make, ⁓ it was like our promise when we created this is to formulate without palm oil. And that has been like a really big challenge. It costs 30 % more to formulate without palm oil. And just to formulate is really tricky, but we managed to do it.

So yeah, it was just creating something that was, this is in a saturated market, but it ⁓ just hadn't been kind of, I guess ⁓ executed in design way.

Caroline Kennedy (12:21)
Yeah. And I think that that to me stands out with your brand because you're right. Even when I was looking at selling my house and we were doing like bathroom styling, not that I'm nowhere near to the degree that you guys are, but going and looking for something that elevated the space, you just couldn't really find anything. And so even that spark with that idea that you had six months prior and it's sitting with you. And I like that you evolved it from we'll collaborate with Palmolive to then we have our own brand that's very conscious and feels like us. And I loved when you said something jumped in my body. And when you said that, I got goosebumps all over. And I actually believe in that sometimes ideas just come to us and they're meant to be as well. And that's our pathway, even though it doesn't seem logical at the time.

Alisa Fraser (13:05)
And it's like that intuition. It's like that feeling in the pit of your stomach. And it hasn't left. And it's that knowing. And we had that on the blog when we got select. Well, we hadn't even been told that we'd made it onto the blog. But we knew we were going to get onto the blog. And we knew we were going to win it. It was so weird. And it's like that gut feeling inside your stomach where you have people and some family that say, why are you doing this? It's risky. It's saturated. And they don't have the confidence.

And not once, not once have I ever doubted it. So then I went to Lysandra and I was like, hey, I've been working really hard in the background. And she saw it she's like, my god, I love it. Now I can see the vision, totally on board. So much so, she sold her house to back it. So there's been a lot of sacrifices and a lot of risk taking to get to where we are. It certainly hasn't been on a silver platter. And it certainly hasn't been with won that money on the block and now we're dropping it into that. Like she lived in a shitty unit for, I don't know, four years, you know? When she sold her house, she was living in the back of her friend's house. Like there's been sacrifices and people don't see that. They see the beautiful home and the nice car that you drive now. And yeah, so just think that's really important.

Caroline Kennedy (14:19)
Recognise. Yeah. And when you hear stories of businesses that are successful, you know, it's that perception of it's instant. It's not instant. Like you said, it's been 13, 14 years of hard work, of risk, of I'm sure stress because you're putting everything on the line. Your family's on the line. Yeah.

Alisa Fraser (14:37)
With your family and your kids and they don't get the best of you and you know it yeah.

Caroline Kennedy (14:42)
Yeah, yeah. But perseverance to keep pushing through and keep going. And I think that's really critical. And family businesses can be powerful, but also kind of explosive. I see that a lot in the work that I do. So what's the one thing people admire about you both? And I think that that's your bond and that's a strength that you both have as sisters and business partners. But how do you like how do you bring that closeness yet? I'm sure at times there are differing views as well. How do you manage that?

Alisa Fraser (15:15)
Yeah, it's like this love hate, hey, it's like you couldn't do it with anyone else but your sister, maybe your twin sister or that. If anyone watched The Block, would know what we're talking about. Lucky we're sisters, otherwise it would be classified as domestic violence. We spoke to each other. But it was really hard at the beginning. And I think the hard part came from because it was my vision and having such a clear idea.

It was really hard to let go of that and to almost like meet in the middle. So there was definitely some clashes and like, no, you run the business, no, you run the business then. And I was like, this isn't worth it. You do it. She was like, well, I can't do it, so you do it. I was like, I'm not working with you because I hate you at the moment. But I guess the beauty of that was, yes, it was tough. we went through some, it was just a different way of working.

And I think what was really great about it was we still needed, we still had our design business and we still have our personal brand and that requires attention as well. And so we kind of sat down and were like, all right, we can't both be in each other's pockets and we don't have the time to collaborate every second to get approval from each other. We just don't. So we made the decision that like she would move over to the interior design side and run that and help with the personal brand stuff because that takes a lot of time.

And then I would run al.ive body and then we would come together for big decisions. Any kind of design sign off, any campaign sign off, any new product development or likewise with her, we both had the final say on the finished result or along the way as well. So that was actually a really good balance. I think making that decision and being able to have that conversation was really healthy. And now we've just got a really good balance. Like we don't even work together in the same office anymore.

She, she works as designer from her home office. Work from home and we come together and we do podcasts together and we do filming and she does a lot of content now with the al.ive body. So she's kind of moved over to more of the creative side, doing all the photo shoots and content and ⁓ it all takes time and we actually probably need to be like an October or something because we need eight of us. But I guess that's the benefit as well of being able to have, know, we literally live right next door. We built a house together and her cat literally lives here with me.

So it's nice. We found a good balance the first time in a long time.

Caroline Kennedy (17:43)
Yeah. And I think what I'm hearing too is that when you decide this is the area that I'm going to focus on, this will be my responsibility. And then having those clear boundaries, even though you know you're both critical to each other because you are in a partnership, but knowing that this is the area I'm going to focus on and this is your area, it just helps with that clarity, doesn't it? yeah. And then therefore, yeah, come together. And because you are in partnership in so many ways, including the personal brand, including the design and al.ive body. And you can't spread thin across all of that. You'll probably find if you had done that, then you wouldn't be a successor.

Alisa Fraser (18:20)
100 % like we divide and conquer really well like she she she knows how strenuous it is running a team of 40 people and she's always got my back to go like anything you need like throw my way I'll pick this up leave this with me.

Caroline Kennedy (18:35)
The lifestyle space is saturated, but you found a point of difference. Was there any moment where you doubted that al.ive body would actually stand out? Like even though you had the intuition, did you ever think, ⁓ no.

Alisa Fraser (18:47)
Never ever ever ever.

Caroline Kennedy (18:49)
And I wonder if that's also a key lesson for any listeners. And why do you think, even though you talked about your intuition before, you just knew that knowing, was there anything else or was it we're just like, as in we're gonna make this work so I have no doubt at all.

Alisa Fraser (19:02)
No, it was just a knowing. It wasn't that I'm going to make this work because I'll work until I die to make it work. It was an intuition. And I've had that my whole life. It's almost like this psychic ability. It's really weird. Like I don't want to go with you. But it is like this. It's in a knowing. I can totally appreciate not everyone has that. And you can't even force it. Like you can't even pretend. Like it's not like you tell yourself. It's not like manifest. Well, manifesting definitely plays a part. But it's not like you just say to yourself and then it happens.

It's just you can't fake that knowing, you know? ⁓

Caroline Kennedy (19:33)
Yeah, I think I've had it a few times in my life. It's really interesting. And sometimes I move away from it and then I come back. But the one time that stands out for me was when I was put forward for a Telstra Business Women's Award and I was doing my submission and I just knew I just knew that that was on the right path and it was going to happen. And it's strange because I had no idea. You just know and then what happens and then there are times I move away from it and think where is it?

It's not that I'm trying to force it. It's just... I'm it.

Alisa Fraser (20:06)
I 100 % understand that wholeheartedly and because that's kind of happened to me a little bit like where you lose course a little bit or you go off track and it's not like it's not like you doubt yourself but you're like it's that that energy or that whole it's gonna be okay kind of goes away but you know what that is to me that's when you need that's when you've got so much shit in your head and you're blocking so you're resisting it

And when you resist something or you fight against something or you try to control a situation too much, that's when it goes off course. And that's when you need to take a holiday and you need to walk around in nature and you need to go listen to like photo or something that clears all the energy out so that you don't have that blockage and it's there. That's why it comes in waves. I swear. I don't want to go woo woo. But that was like a big eye opener to me the other month when I was like, oh, I'm just so used to have so much clarity. used to.

I went to Bali and then went for a walk every morning around the beautiful garden and listened to Buddha and I was like, I came back and I had this different energy and I was like, there it is. I knew it was there, it just, you need to clear out all that negative energy and yeah.

Caroline Kennedy (21:19)
Yeah. All right. Well, I'm taking a holiday to Bali. I'm going to tell my husband after I get off this podcast, we're off to Bali.

Alisa Fraser (21:24)
It's so important and rest is so important and I'm preaching to the wrong person. But I'm actually going to Bali again in a couple of weeks so I'm trying to now just take that time but 100 % the rest when you're so busy rest is actually more important than to keep grinding and going and going because you actually then become very unproductive and you're spinning wheels.

Caroline Kennedy (21:30)
The unconverted, yeah.

Alisa Fraser (21:52)
So taking a breather, even if it's a week or four days, whatever it is, just really gives you that time to reset and to think with clarity.

Caroline Kennedy (22:02)
Yeah. So launching into the skincare area was bold and a brilliant move as well. It's only been recently too, because I think I watched an actual video somehow of the launch and the unboxing and the excitement with you both. And you're also now in my RIC. So you're competing against these global giants, right? And for you, how did you make it happen? How did you decide now we're going to go into skincare?

Alisa Fraser (22:29)
To think the transition into skincare was actually quite organic one. We created al.ive because it solved a problem that we were finding, which was beautiful styling items within your home that are also functional, which is how the kitchen trio came about. No one likes having bloody dishwashing liquid and crap on your bench. You always hide it away when your friends come over. So the kitchen trio was born. Same with the hair duo as well. No one likes having those ugly bottles in the shower.

Skincare was one of those problems that our customers were asking for it they've been asking for it for a long time. So it was a little bit hard to ignore. Also, came from probably everything that we've created has been a result of what is missing in our lives. And skincare was one of those ones where you might go get a facial, you might go to Mecca, you might go to wherever and get your skincare and you might buy one product here, one product there.

And then what ends up happening is you don't know how to use it. You don't know how to layer it. It's ugly. So then it gets put in a drawer behind your shaving cabinet and you don't use it. So it was that moment of first and foremost, we create beautiful products on the outside and the in, but they have to be functional. So we spent so long on formulating these products.

We engaged Australia's leading natural chemists. We've worked with an Australian skin expert to create a system that was effortless, that we had done all the thinking for you that laid beautifully that covered every skin concern and was suitable for every skin type. We've also created in such a beautiful way that you want to display it on your vanity. And the best part about that is that you are compliant because it is in front of you. And it's an experience that you actually enjoy day and night. It's in the morning. It's all like even the naming conventions make it so easy. When I wake, before I sleep, you don't have to guess when am I using this product. ⁓

And we've got seven products out in the market, which you don't need any more than that. You don't even need seven. Like the way that we've created, you can have that full routine, which has everything covered that you require for your skin. And the best part, I think the number one thing for having beautiful skin is that compliance, if you're using it consistently every day. And that is why we created al.ive Skin, because selfishly, we needed it in our lives. And we knew that our customers were wanting it.

And yeah, it was just, I think, a natural evolution.

Caroline Kennedy (24:58)
Yeah. And you know what I love about that is that you've simplified it because it honestly, skincare and beauty is so complex. You're right. walk into make a Sephora or whatever you like. Where am I going? What am I doing? What am I purchasing? What do I need? And it just is very complicated. So you saw a problem and you helped to solve it, which is really genius in an industry that overcomplicates everything.

Alisa Fraser (25:23)
You just need to find, you know, what is missing out there. And I think we certainly found it and they're refillable as well. So they're sustainable, which is really important to us. And the biggest thing, like you said, it's effortless. I think another big thing is like, because we are palm oil free, there's competitors out there that will say on the website, we cannot formulate skincare without palm oil. We use Roundtable, Responsibly Sourced, blah, blah, greenwashing. And we're like, well, if we can't achieve a full skincare range without using palm oil, then we're not doing it. Yeah.

And it costs so much money to develop because there's so many iterations of it. The biggest thing for us is like even when we using our competitor brands, the layering of the product, I don't, I'm a baller. So you can like some products will fall on your face if you use like a serum and then use a moisturiser and then you put your makeup on, you get all this like flaky skin. And luckily I am a baller because we picked that up in testing. So there were many, many iterations to make sure that each layer and it was like this process of elimination to say like what product is causing that. So it was a long drawn out process. So everything has been considered like down to every last piece, which is why it took so long to get it to market.

Caroline Kennedy (26:38)
How long did it take?

Alisa Fraser (26:40)
Over two years, reckon it's about two and a half years.

Caroline Kennedy (26:42)
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's quite extensive, isn't it? And I can imagine, I know you want to get it right and you want it to be, you know, as you're going through removing the products or the ingredients that might be causing that. But I can imagine that that was quite frustrating every new iteration of it. Even though was satisfying to know that you were developing something that had that point of difference, but also frustrating when you get an iteration, you're like, no, it's not quite there. When are we going to get it? It feels never ending, doesn't it? Yeah. Until it ends.

Alisa Fraser (27:12)
Everything always, know, out. You just have to be patient.

Caroline Kennedy (27:16)
And for you, what's the hardest personal lesson that this journey has taught you?

Alisa Fraser (27:21)
I think the hardest part about it all is the sacrifice I have to make with my family. Because there is sacrifice, I'm not going to sit here and go, ⁓ they don't suffer because they do. They see me stressed most days. They see me walking through the door. I'm out of the door just after like quarter past five in the morning. Some nights I don't get home until 7.30 at night. So they don't get the best of me all the time.

But yeah, I think that's the hardest part for me. That will be, and I try not to guilt myself because you can't do it like you just have to do the best you can. And my mum, you know, we grew up with my mum running a business and we spent every waking hour at the business and kids get a great life and they don't, you know, it's just mum's guilt all the time. just feeling like you're letting people down or your husband down because you're not spending the time with him or the kids or but then also like having time for all the stuff and then also trying to find some time for yourself. And that's the biggest.

Caroline Kennedy (28:16)
And it know what's really interesting about that is that when I hear people talk about work-life balance I'm like there is no such thing and if you're attempting to attain that you've got to set yourself up for failure because and you know what I also think too, what you're saying is that you work hard because that's ingrained in you, but you're also teaching your kids about hard work too. they watch you and roll a lot of for them. And I'm not saying it's easy.

And I know the whole mum guilt thing, any mum that has kids generally feels it, you know, and even if you're not working those hours, there's still something you're to feel guilty about, you know? And, and so, but it is to recognise that people can assume that when you build something that's successful, that it has come easy or that because like you said earlier that you had that exposure in that brand that it was easy, but it wasn't. are lots of sacrifices that come with that, but you choose them. And I think it's important for listeners to realise that there are sacrifices and hard work and risk, risk. You put a lot on the line to do something you're passionate about.

Alisa Fraser (29:21)
And think probably the takeaway there is like, you really have to be passionate about it and don't do it if you're not, you know, because there are way more harder days, way, way, way, way, way, way, way more harder days than there are easy days. And you have to love it. You have to really believe in it. Don't do it to make money. Don't do it to think it's creating your own life.

You you get to make your own decisions and what you do, but it's not, it's certainly not what entrepreneurship is kind of made up to be. It's not as glamorous. I wouldn't have it any other way. I could never work for anyone ever, ever again, ever, ever.

Caroline Kennedy (30:00)
Yeah. As we wrap up, last questions for you. Which one is kind of a segue to what you were just talking about? Is there anything else you would tell any entrepreneur that's listening that are in the messy middle and perhaps they're at that burnout point and they're questioning themselves? Is there anything else that you would say to them?

Alisa Fraser (30:26)
I mean, I've been there many, many, many, many, many times and you decide, I want this to end like, and it does like it does, but as well, if nothing changes, nothing changes and something has to change for you to either get out of that mindset or get out of the, the rut. And it could be small changes. And I honestly believe you need to surround yourself with absolute best people that you can surround yourself with.

I think that is like so important, but also like it's almost like, and depends on what stage of the business that you're at. Obviously the earlier you are, you know, money is tight. mean, you you always have to watch your money anyway, but ⁓ it's kind of like the who, not the how as well. If you're stuck because you don't know how to do something, like try and find a person that does or that can tell you how to do it. Yeah. whole who, how, which is there's a really good book on that actually. It's called who, not how.

Yeah, I think there's a lot of pain that people can save themselves. I think you've also got to be open to finding people that can help.

Caroline Kennedy (31:36)
Yeah, yeah. And so what I'm hearing is that if somebody's walked the journey before you, it might be worthwhile figuring out how they can support you on that, right? And I love that if nothing changes, nothing changes. I say that all the time. so it's important. What are we going to do differently? What does that look like? And what support is there?

Alisa Fraser (31:56)
Yeah. And sometimes you have to make really tough decisions. I make tough decisions all the time and it gets easier. But, um, especially the beginning, it's hard, but just back yourself and also don't let anyone else take over. Like, you know, your business the best and yes, they're open and the who, the how, but also just be really careful of when you let go too much as well. You lose touch and people don't always, you know, do as good a job as you do because you know the business so well.

Caroline Kennedy (32:26)
Yeah, well, it's your baby, isn't it? It might not be theirs. Even though they have some expertise, doesn't mean it's their baby. Yeah, but they might not necessarily, well, they don't have the same skin in the game that you have, but nobody else will. Yeah. And all right, so last question. If you could go back and speak to the two of you on the block, what advice would you whisper in your own ear?

Alisa Fraser (32:31)
I feel like I do everything the hard way. And I think there's a part of that that is potentially like an ADHD thing where my brain doesn't compute a lot of things in it. I feel like I get to places the long way. So I would be telling myself hire people that can help you get there quicker, hand off the things that you're not good at or passionate about and focus on the things that really drive you forward because you can get caught in the weeds doing lots of doing, but it's, you know, the 80-20 rule and the big rock, the small rock. Yeah. So just being really clear on why you're doing something and what the result you want to get from that because time is, you know, there's only a limited amount of time and there's a million things that you can focus on. But just being really clear on what those key drivers are.

Caroline Kennedy (33:22)
Grip the needle stuff.

Yeah. So as we wrap up, Alisa, thank you so much for your honesty today and your vulnerability. think that's really important for people to hear that. And so from reality TV beginnings to building a brand that is standing shoulder to shoulder, we've got global players, your story shows us and all listeners that resilience and reinvention are the real game changers here, right? And so to our listeners, if this episode has sparked something in you, subscribe to the Honest CEO Show on anywhere that you listen to your podcasts and check out other episodes at carolinekennedy.com.au. And thank you so much, Alisa. I really appreciate your time.

Alisa Fraser (34:14)
Pleasure, thanks for having me.